What's Llandudno Like Right Now?

[DaveR]

Extensive flooding around town. Fire Service are pumping out properties on the council estate by Asda.

[Hugo]

Here's an article from the Daily Post about the flooding in Llandudno


https://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/north-wales-news/storm-babet-llandudno-residents-evacuated-27952493

[SteveH]

A friends garden close to the Oval, he hired a pump to help the flooding, I also heard that the Gogarth councillors, Harry Saville and Louis Emery were out and about visiting those affected, they also sent out this advice..........

STORM BABET UPDATE
Many parts of Llandudno have been affected by flooding during Storm Babet.  Flood water appeared to be receding at the time of writing this email, nonetheless, we wanted to provide an update in case conditions deteriorate.

Welsh Water's pumping stations are operating at full capacity.  They struggled to cope with large amounts of rain water and a high tide on Friday afternoon.  Welsh Water are continuing to monitor the situation.

Cartrefi Conwy, North Wales Police and Conwy County Borough Council have been assisting those most affected within the Gogarth Mostyn ward and like Welsh Water, they will continue to monitor the storm overnight.

Localised flooding should be reported to Conwy County Borough Council by calling 01492 577999.  More details are available online here.

The Council have produced a guide on what to do before, during and after flooding.  This can be found online here.

Flooding can still be dangerous even if your home is not at risk.  Even shallow floodwater can hide trip hazards, such as raised manhole covers.

The Council have also set up a dedicated page listing road and local service closures.  This can be found online here. https://www.conwy.gov.uk/en/Resident/Crime-and-emergencies/Preparing-for-Emergencies/Flooding/documents/Flooding-Advice-and-Guidance-2020-ENG.pdf

If you are in immediate danger, contact the emergency services by calling 999. 

[Hugo]

That's such a shame and I feel really sorry for all those people affected by the flooding.  I'm pleased that some of the local Councillors have turned out and offered their support to those people affected
Sadly it's not the first time this has happened and it won't be the last time either which is rather sad

[Hugo]

The North Wales beauty spot that's been entrancing visitors for almost 14,000 years
From sunken palaces, ancient mines, hidden reservoirs and unrivalled attractions it's still captivating to this day


https://www.dailypost.co.uk/whats-on/trips-breaks/north-wales-beauty-spot-thats-27934559

[SteveH]

That's such a shame and I feel really sorry for all those people affected by the flooding.  I'm pleased that some of the local Councillors have turned out and offered their support to those people affected
Sadly it's not the first time this has happened and it won't be the last time either which is rather sad

This flooding was down to bad drainage again, between the council and Welsh Water this needs to be sorted quickly, a lot of angry talk
on social media.

[Cambrian]

Just a few thoughts.

If the drains and sewers are already surcharged, there wouldn't seem much point in pumping out until the levels subside and the water will drain away.

One factor in the Friday flooding is that there was a heavy wind causing the sea to lash onto North Shore.  This will have affected the discharge of surface water from the Washington Outfall - which drains most of Craig y Don..  Once that becomes tide-locked it results in Craig y Don and Liddell Park flooding incidents, there is then a knock-on affect on the Afon Creuddyn system which flows from Cae Clyd to the pumping station (s) at West Shore via Tre Creuddyn and the Oval. There is also a large land drainage catchment south of Conway Road the flow from which mainly goes to the Afon Creuddyn.

Efforts in the past to deal with the problems do not seem to have been very effective. Time for the Creuddyn overflow pumping station capacity to be looked at yet again! (This is the anonymous, garage-like, brick building in Lloyd Street West with the "No Tipping - CCTV" notice). 

[Hugo]

Efforts in the past to deal with the problems do not seem to have been very effective. Time for the Creuddyn overflow pumping station capacity to be looked at yet again! (This is the anonymous, garage-like, brick building in Lloyd Street West with the "No Tipping - CCTV" notice).

Cambrian, isn't that the same pumping station that failed in the great flood of 1993?       I thought that I read that that pumping station had moved from there to higher ground and is now the building near the Boating Lake
When the electrics failed back in 1993 there was no manual over ride so that's why the water remained in the town for so long

[SteveH]

Quote(Efforts in the past to deal with the problems do not seem to have been very effective. Time for the Creuddyn overflow pumping station capacity to be looked at yet again! )

Cambrian, I think you have summed it up very well.

Yesterday we heard a lot of scaffolding work going on in the area, looking today three lots of roofers working on them, and at least two scaffold firms setting up on other properties, a very busy and noisy Sunday, looks like the storm was responsible for more than ground flooding, I count myself lucky this time.

Mondie, if you read this, the above photo was very close to your old house near the Oval 

[Cambrian]

Thanks both.  My understanding from memory and chatting to Welsh Water people over the years is broadly this:

The drainage system at the West Shore end has become more complicated over the years.  The old UDC pumping station was underground just beyond the yachting pond.  That used to pump sewage (not fully treated) via a short sea outfall.  In the 1980s a long sea outfall was constructed with a pumping station (Dale Road) at the far end of the site now occupied by the miniature railway.  The "old" pumping station then simply pumped its flow to the Dale Road one and thence out to sea. The one that failed in 1993 was the "old" station as it was itself inundated with falling rain.  Welsh Water then rebuilt the control systems and panels above ground in what resembles a promenade shelter (of sorts). That dealt with what was mainly foul flows.  To deal with the Afon Creuddyn surface water sewer they built the Lloyd Street West one to act as a relief in times of heavy rain if the flow reached a certain critical level. The pumps in Lloyd St W then "blast" the whole inflow out onto West Shore.  In normal circumstances, the dry weather flow in the Creuddyn goes to the UDC station and is pumped via Dale Road and various other intermediate pumping stations all the way the "Ganol" waste water treatment works at Glan Conwy Corner.

The Afon Creuddyn itself has a convoluted and interesting history having been at various times an Agricultural Drain, a Scheduled Main Riverand finally a public surface water sewer. It originally had its own separate outfall at West Shore. East of Cae Clyd, it actually has a physical connection with the Washington Outfall system running down Clarence Road and this is evident from old maps before development took place.

Hugo - you may recall the Creuddyn as a ditch which gradually culverted in sections over many years mainly through the estate.  It ran at the back of Cwm Road towards the signal box.

[Hugo]

Hugo - you may recall the Creuddyn as a ditch which gradually culverted in sections over many years mainly through the estate.  It ran at the back of Cwm Road towards the signal box.

Thanks Cambrian, that brought back some nice childhood memories for me.    I'm old enough to remember when there were just fields behind my house in Cwm Place and the nearest building was John Bright's Grammar School.    The Afon Creuddyn was just like a ditch and flowed down Jackson's Lane on the other side to where the farm once was.      I remember the large concrete pipes that transferred the water under the Conway Road and below the houses on the council estate but I was never brave enough to crawl through those pipes.
The pipes came out by the Welsh School in Cwm Road and the ditch was open until 1973 when that too was culverted.     By the railings belonging to British Rail was a flat wooden bridge that took you over the river from Builder Street and I've got clear memories of that too.
I noticed on an 1889 O/S map that directly opposite that point was another river and that flowed in a straight line behind the western side of Clifton Road ( before Maelgwyn Road was built ) and then it curved before reaching the railway.   It must have been a fair sized river because stepping stones are shown on the map.
Your posting brought up some interesting points and Bodafon as it's name suggests had water channels there.  According to books I have read Ffynnon Sadwrn had a plentiful supply of water, that was until Mostyn Estates diverted the water when they built a drainage ditch

[DaveR]

It was clear to me last Friday that it was only the fact the rain eased off during the afternoon that prevented a major flooding problem occurring in central Llandudno, similar in scale to the 1993 floods.

The pumping capacity for the town's surface water drainage is obviously inadequate and CCBC's own negligence in failing to carry out routine road drain clearing (when was the last time you saw a lorry cleaning out the drains?) also contributed to the problem.

We had a lucky escape last Friday - let's hope lessons are learned and action is take to address the problems.

[Hugo]

Response to Storm Babet flooding in Llandudno defended amid 'complete chaos' claim
'It has been heart-breaking to see residents in a state of distress and feeling completely helpless in the midst of rising water'

Let's hope that lessons have been learned from this latest flooding as it'll happen again and it might not be another 30 years before the town floods again, it might be a lot sooner

https://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/north-wales-news/response-storm-babet-flooding-llandudno-27973831

[SteveH]

Cllr McCoubrey said the storm was extreme, affecting all parts of the UK.
?As news reports from across the UK showed, the conditions during Storm Babet were extreme,? he said. ?Emergency service and local authority partners across North Wales met regularly and worked closely throughout the day to ensure a co-ordinated approach to the weather conditions.

Its no good  saying the whole of the UK was affected, CCBC only have to worry about Conwy residents, also as has already been said
not enough pre-emptive work carried out, by both the council and Welsh Water, I have written to local councilors expressing my opinions.

[Cambrian]

One thing not mentioned so far is the availability of two heavy duty pumps stored in a building next to Llandudno Fire Station. These are part of a regional strategy for use in serious flooding.  Occasionally you can see one or both on the forecourt being checked over and maintained.

It is surprising that these were not mobilised to augment the clearly overtaxed capacity of the Afon Creuddyn relief pumping station.

Incidentally post 1993, there was another issue about 15 years ago when Tre Creuddyn estate roads started to flood.  Water was beginning to lap at doorways when fortunately someone asked a WW employee to check whether the relief station had kicked in. Apparently it had not and was switched on; the effect was magical as within minutes the flood disappeared down the highway gullies to everyone's relief.